Crossing the Jordan, interview with Cindy

This podcast episode follows Cindy's emotional journey through multiple miscarriages, highlighting her reliance on faith, community support, and trust in God. Despite the challenges, Cindy and her husband find strength and hope, eventually welcoming their miracle baby, Jordan. Themes of overcoming grief, finding identity in God, and the power of prayer resonate throughout the narrative, emphasizing the importance of leaning on community and holding onto hope during times of adversity.

Transcript

Ann: 0:13

In this podcast, you'll listen to stories of women from all different walks of life and backgrounds. You'll hear stories of painful past and how women have overcome by putting their hope in Jesus Christ. Friends, I wanna encourage you to listen to this podcast, Her Scars Tell a Story, a safe space for women coming together To share their stories and their hearts. I pray that you would be inspired, Encouraged and that your hope in Christ would be renewed. My name is Ann Calvillo, and I'm your host. Tune in to her scars tell a story podcast now. Hey everyone. Welcome to Her Scars Tell a Story podcast. I'm your host, Anne Calvillo. I hope you all are having a wonderful day. It's morning right now, Saturday morning, and I'm with my wonderful guest today, Cindy, Cindy, welcome. Thank you so much, Anne,

Cindy: 1:22

for just having me.

Ann: 1:24

Absolutely, Cindy. I know that, um, I was actually speaking with Maritza and how is she related to you again?

Cindy: 1:34

Um, my cousin.

Ann: 1:36

Yeah,

Cindy: 1:37

you're the family. I know we're related in some way, yes. It's like, I feel like we're all related.

Ann: 1:42

Yeah. Yeah. One big happy family.

Cindy: 1:45

Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, I've known, yeah. So she's known me since I was little.

Ann: 1:50

So she actually reached out to me. And, um, she was like, you know, you really have to have my, uh, my cousin Cindy on the podcast. She's like, uh, she really has a powerful testimony of, um, just God's miraculous. Hand over her and I was like, absolutely. So I reached out to you and, um, without hesitation, you shared your story with me and, you know, I was, I was moved in so many ways, uh, because I can relate to your story and so, um, you know, I just, You know, as I've shared with you earlier when I was praying this morning, I just realized how Mother's Day is next week, you know, and, um, I just thought, wow, this is so fitting, um, for it, you know, it's timely. It's a timely. Message for mothers. And so, um, I don't want to give your story away. I want to give you that space to share your story, Cindy, but it's been really nice connecting with you and getting the opportunity to hear your story. It's been a blessing to me. But Cindy, please go ahead and tell us a little bit about yourself and your story.

Cindy: 3:07

Yes. Oh, well, thank you. And I know when. Marissa reached out, she's like, you should really like, have you thought about sharing your testimony? And I was like, yeah, you know, I've been wanting to do like, maybe like a Tik TOK or, you know, like an Instagram post and I was like, it's just so long to write and, you know, you kind of lose people when it's so long. So I was like, I really want my message to hit someone and, you know, so someone can actually read it. And she's like, Well, I have a friend who does a podcast and she's like, are you okay if I share your information? I'm like, what? Thank you, God. Like you are so totally doing this and, um, I was like, yeah, go ahead, share my info with her. So that was really a blessing that she did that. I'm so grateful for her just kind of leading the way, you know, from me to you and now for everyone to kind of just hear.

Ann: 3:58

Yeah, that's, that's a God thing. You know, he sets things up like that.

Cindy: 4:03

Yeah, so true. Amen. Um, and I know I was like struggling with like, all right. Um, just being raw and vulnerable and sharing a piece. I have so many testimonies just about God, what he's done in my life. Um, and I feel like this is just one of the big ones and just to kind of get down with like the timeline. So I have, um, Me and my husband, right? We, we met in 2016. We got married in 2020. Um, and previously I had a son, um, and he's nine years old and praise God. He is, um, my husband you know, just like his legal father. Um, and that's another testimony in itself with what God has done in our life with that situation. But, um, so I had a son when I was 20 going on 21. And then I met my husband, um, and pretty much I was like, you know what, I don't want any kids anymore. After I had my son, I was just like, I'm not going to have any more kids. Um, I ended up just kind of getting on an IUD and, you know, I had like the 10 year one and, um, I pretty much had that for five years. So when me and my husband were like, okay, we want to have kids and, you know, Let's start after we got married. We're like, let's have kids. And I was like, yeah, you know, like this is amazing. It's exciting. Um, let's go ahead and let's do it. And pretty much in August of 2020, uh, right after we got married, we got married in July. So that next month, right after I was like, all right, we're going to start trying to have a baby. Uh, and we ended up getting pregnant. We got pregnant the next month in September of 2020. And I was like, wow, like, God, that was, that was so fast. Like, thank you, God, it happened so quickly. Um, and we ended up losing the baby. I was around six, seven weeks. Um, And at first when it happened, I was like, I was pretty much kind of like, wow, I didn't really realize that things like that happened. Uh, I've never really heard of anyone losing a baby before that. Uh, maybe, you know, it's just, I feel like it's something that it's never talked about. Like no one in my family ever shared them having a miscarriage or anything like that. And once that happened, I told my mom and my mom's like, you know, your aunt had that happen and you know, so and so has that happened and their next baby. They, you know, stuck and they have, you know, that's your cousin now and, you know, she's here. So hearing that, I was like, okay, like it can happen. Uh, maybe the next one, maybe this, this, you know, wasn't meant to be. Um, so we ended up getting pregnant a second time. Um, and we found out, I would say the beginning of February in 2021, um, we ended up sharing the news with our son. The ending of February, like we bought him, I'm going to be a big brother book. And, you know, we had him on like unwrapped the gift and he was so excited, um, and he was five at the time. Um, and then we ended up losing the baby March of 2021. Um, and I just remember that one hit really hard for us because we ended up taking him to The hospital with us to kind of get the ultrasound and um, it was during COVID so they weren't letting like anyone come in. So my husband and him waited outside in the car and I went in and I just remember kind of laying there and the ultrasound technician was like, can you hold your breath for me? And you know, it was like holding my breath and she's just like, Looking around in my belly and she's like, you know, hold it again. And I was just like, I remember with my first one, it wasn't like that. So I was like, why is she having me hold my breath for? And, you know, she kind of didn't say anything. And I'm like, I remember before they would tell you like, Oh, you know, the baby's doing great. Do you want to see the baby? And, you know, things like that. Um, so. She kind of just like, okay, you know, put your clothes at like, just cover yourself up unless, you know, I want you to kind of wait outside in the waiting area. So I'm just like, okay, what's happening? Like maybe it's twins or like, you know, she can't tell me, maybe the doctor has to tell me. And, um, so she brings me into another room and it was the doctor on the line and she was like, Cindy, I'm so sorry, but there's no heartbeat. And I was just like, what? Like, what, what do you mean? There's no heartbeat. Like that's just. Even so again, I was just so like, I couldn't grasp it. And I just remember I, my whole mind just went, it was just blurry blank. I couldn't even remember how to get out of the hospital. Like I was just kind of walking around trying to find the exits and, you know, you had to wear your mask. So I had the mask and the tears were just rolling down my face. And I called my husband and I'm like, we lost the baby. It has no heartbeat. Um, and I was just, I was running to get to him just so I can like hug him. Um, and yeah, our son kind of got out the car and he's like, why are you crying? And I was like, oh my gosh, how do I even tell him? Um, we kind of just both got in the car and we were both crying and we were like, oh, you know, buddy, um, your sibling went to heaven and you know, he kind of took him a while to kind of understand. Um, but his birthday was like literally a couple of days away. So it was just a tough time trying to. Navigate the grief that we were going through while still celebrating our son and, you know, being like happy that he was, you know, celebrating his life. He's here, he has a birthday. Um, so it was a very tough time. I remember that second one really hit hard for us. I think it was just everyone giving us hope and telling their stories. Like I've had a miscarriage and then I had this cousin or, you know, things like that. And it's like, well, why did it happen again? Now we have two miscarriages. Um, And then it was around that time too, that a lot of people close to me were having babies. Um, everyone was sharing their pregnancy news and. It really hit me, um, just kind of seeing inside of me, like how much envy I was having. Um, I was so bitter, very bitter about it. Um, and one pregnancy in particular, uh, it was my, my best friend, uh, she got pregnant and I just remember I really distanced myself and even now I still think about it and I'm just like, I felt so terrible. Like I wasn't there for you when you were pregnant. Like when I look back, it's just like, I really wasn't there for you, but she completely understands, you know, she's like, I totally get it. Cindy, you were grieving and, um, you were just going through a lot. So praise God that she's just a, such a godly woman in my life that she never made me feel bad about it. You know, she just kind of understood what I was going through. Um, but I do remember one, one moment where. You know, she called me and she's like, I haven't heard from you and she was due in April. So this is March and she's like, I haven't heard from you. Like, you've been very quiet and we just had such a real conversation. You know, she's like, I get scared. Like I don't want to share photos online because I know you're going to see them. And she's like, I'm just like, I kind of feel bad. Like why am I pregnant? And why isn't Cindy pregnant? And. We like cried together and I'm like, I don't want you to feel that way. Like I'm, I feel horrible that I'm making you feel like you shouldn't be happy in this moment. Um, but I feel like that's what sisters in Christ and best friends are for, right? It says like, rejoice when people are rejoicing and weep when people are weeping. And she was weeping with me, um, just kind of knowing what we were going through and I was telling her, I was like, look, I, I feel a lot of envy. You know, I was like, maybe that's just my life now. And she's like, Cindy, that's not you. You're not an envious person. She's like, you've never have been envious about anything. You've always been so like, you know, praise God for everyone and being happy and everyone's blessing. So she's like, that's just the enemy trying to get in your head. And I was like, thank you. You know, like I needed that. I needed to snap out of it and tell myself who God says I am. And no, I am not that person. You know, like, and, and no enemy. You're not gonna win. You're not gonna get in my head and I'm not gonna be envious for my friend having, you know, life and that's a miracle. Um, and right after that we had another third pregnancy. Um, it was November of 2021, um, and we lost it in January of 2022. Um, kind of my mother in law and sister in law, they knew someone in the church that they, um, were attending, or they kind of went to when they were younger. Uh, they connected me with someone. That has pretty much been through losses as well. And, uh, they went through a fertility clinic and I believe they did IVF. Um, so, you know, she's like, maybe you can talk to her. Maybe you guys can, you know, do some testing, kind of get to the root of what is happening. Um, so we did talk to the doctor. Uh, we just kind of had, you know, blood work and everything done, especially they were like, you know, you, you had a son before. So. We know you can get pregnant, um, and they're just like, maybe, who knows, like they, they really didn't know what was causing it. Um, but I was just like, you know what, God, if this is the route that we need to go, then like open those doors. And they, they were, they were open. We, we met with the doctor very quickly. Like we were just shocked. It was like, wow, it's happening so fast. Um, meeting with the doctor, doing all the testing. Um, and. We ended up getting pregnant right after talking to the doctor again, the fourth pregnancy, um, that was August of 2022. And we ended up losing the baby of October of 2022. Um, so they were all just pretty much back to back. Um, I remember with our fourth one, we were just like, all right, you know, like here it is, it's going to happen. It's happening. Um, but one day, uh, right. It was right. It was the day of the miscarriage in October. It was October 3rd. I remember it. We were heading to the pumpkin farm. And I remember just waking up that morning and wanting to hear testimonies of women who overcame miscarriage and Multiple miscarriages and now they have their, their baby. So that's what I typed in women, um, you know, overcoming multiple miscarriages and now having their baby. And just, I don't know why I know. Well, now I know why I know it was God just telling me like, Cindy, you're going to miscarry this baby, but there's hope at the end of it, like, look at all these women that overcame multiple. And I remember hearing women that had five, seven, 11, and. They, they had their baby now and you know, I was just getting ready and sure enough, when we got to the pumpkin patch, I told my husband, I was like, I don't know, like I'm cramping. And, you know, he's like, let's go to the bathroom. Let's take it easy. You know, we won't do the hayride and, you know, we'll just like walk a little bit. We'll sit down and, you know, we were very cautious with everything. You know, he's like, don't, don't stand for too long. You know, he was just like, whatever we can do to not have us miscarry. But when I went to the bathroom, sure enough, I was bleeding. And I was like, You know, we're gonna miscarry again. Um, sorry, I'm getting, oh, it's, it always just brings me to tears, thinking about it. Um, and I just remember the next day, um, pretty much at nighttime the bleeding just came back really heavy and we went to the hospital and, you know, they were there and they're like, yeah, and we did the ultrasound. And she's like, I'm sorry, there's nothing there. And I remember from the videos that I. One of the verse that stood out to me was that the woman said that she kind of clinged to was trust in the Lord with all your heart, not on your own understanding. And as I'm laying in that hospital bed and the doctor's just kind of checking me and making sure she's taking all the remains, that verse was just playing all night, replaying, replaying. I kept repeating it. I trust in the Lord. I'm like, God, I don't know why this is happening, but I trust you. And, you know, I was like, that's, that's all I can do. And my husband was You know, he was just crying and he's like, why does this keep happening to us? And I, I had to tell him that verse. I was like, look, I don't know why it's happening, but we have to trust in God. Um, just keep trusting him. And We talk about it now, uh, just how much that whole two, two years, almost three years that we kind of went through it back to back, how much it strengthened our relationship, uh, with God. Uh, you know, his background is he pretty much grew up in a church, uh, he went to a Christian church. He, you know, was there from pre K to high school and he grew up in a Christian family and, um, Where I was pretty much the opposite. I was raised Catholic. I ended up, you know, um, getting saved in 2018. Um, and we pretty much just started our relationship and I was like, you know what, I really pray for you, like, you know, God, but I don't see you having a relationship with him. And. Now I know that our miscarriages was for that, like he is such a strong man of God and he has his own relationship with him. And it's amazing that I know if it wasn't for our miscarriages, we wouldn't, you know, he wouldn't be where he's at now. And I definitely wouldn't have been where I am now. Um, because we just want to, like, we. Had to cling to his word so much and there was so many times where I would come to him and I would be like, I don't know how I'm going to do it. Like, I think with our second mystery, I was like, I don't think I can do this anymore. Like maybe we're just not meant to have kids. And you know, he was like, Well, you know, I can't force you, you know, I, I don't know, you know, he's like, I don't know how you're feeling. Cause it is your body. Your body is literally physically going through the miscarriages and you're going through all the doctor appointments and you know, all everything that they're trying to figure out what's wrong. And, and he's like, I just, if that's how you feel, you know, like I, we have to kind of figure out, is this going to be our life, you know, it was just a lot that we had to kind of go through. But he always just said, you know what, whatever God's will is. And I know it took me a while to kind of get to that point of like, God, what is your will, um, is it, do I continue? And he gave me the strength, honestly, because I still remember with the second one, I was like, I don't know if I can continue doing this and like getting pregnant and losing a baby, like how many times do we have to go through this? And. Sure enough, there we go again with the third one. It, you know, it was just God giving me that strength to continue to have, you know, getting pregnant and even still having hope after the second one, the third one and the fourth one, um, even with, I think right around the third miscarriage, um, I, I remember I was just like, I'm doing it wrong. Like, God, I am loving this idea of having a baby more than I'm loving you. And I think that just, it clicked. Um, there was a sermon that I was watching at my, I used to attend, uh, Chicago Tabernacle. It's in the city. And I would always just kind of tune in right after we moved to Bartlett. Um, and we started going to Wheaton. Um, I would still kind of tune in cause I was just like, I need, I need to hear his word. All the time to help me through the season. And one of the pastors that was giving a sermon, he's like, you need to pray God. If this is your will, then keep that desire in my heart. If it isn't take it away. And that was such a raw. Prayer that I had to pray, you know, and it was almost like, wow, do I really want to pray that? Like, what if it isn't his will and that desire of having a baby, you know, gets away from like, like it's just, it's removed and what, what happens next type of thing. Um, but I remember praying that I was like, God, if this is your will, then keep that desire. And if it isn't, then remove it and give us another path. Um, and that that's kind of, I know I kind of jumped around, but that's kind of what happened with. When we got pregnant again with, with our, our baby now, Jordan, um, I, I was just so hungry for him. I, I just like, I got to the point where it was like, God, like that song says, I want this, you and nothing else, like nothing else matters, just you. And I finally surrendered. I surrendered, you know, my womb having a baby. It's just like, you know what, God, if that doesn't happen, I'm still going to be happy. You know, I'm still going to have joy. Um, I'm still going to be super happy for people that are pregnant, that are in my life, that are not in my life, just having that joy for them. And you really worked with me on that. Um, because right after the, our, our last pregnancy, our fourth pregnancy, um, my sister was getting married and I just remember this was right before we got pregnant. It was December of 2022. Yeah. December of 2022. Um, I was packing my suitcase, my sister was in Florida, so we were going down to Florida for her wedding and I was just like, um, packing my, my suitcase in the closet and, you know, I'm like this late, just sitting there and I had this feeling of like, you need to go on your knees and just pray. And I went on my knees and I just started praying to God and I was just like yelling, you know, I was like, God, I know you're going to give us a baby. And. You know, just that desire is still in my heart. So God, however, you're going to do it. Cause we were kind of battling between IVF and that was our big prayer too. I was like, God, do you want us to do IVF? Do you not? Like, what, what is it? What do we do? Do we adopt? Do we foster? Like, it was just so many questions that I had for him that I just, I felt the Holy Spirit just told me you need to pray. And so I got on my knees, I prayed. And I felt him telling me like, Cindy, your sister's pregnant. Do not get offended. Do not get envious. Um, you know, I work with you on that. You need to be happy for her. And sure enough, my mom calls me, I think maybe a couple hours later, she calls me and she's like, Cindy, I need you to sit down. And I'm like, what, what's happening? What is that? What's going on? What do I need to be sitting down for? And it's like, Your sister's pregnant, but it's okay. You're going to be next. And I was just like, God, you are so good. Like you told me the news before no one else did. You prepared me for it. And I was just in awe. Like he is such a good father. Like he cares for us so much that I told my mom, I was like, mom, I had to talk with the Lord and he shared that news to me already. And I was like, I'm happy. You know, I, I, he told me my time is coming and, you know, she was just like, praise God. Like that's amazing. And we got down to Florida. Um, my sister shared the news with me and we had such a heart to heart. I was like, look, he told me my time is coming. Um, I'm happy for you. Like, praise God. You know, she has her own testimony as well. So I was like, this is a blessing. And, you know, I was like, he has worked so much with me. On just being happy and having joy in my own, you know, like I can't compare my blessings to your blessings like I have my own blessings and, you know, he, he just told me your time is coming. And sure enough, when we got back, we were waiting, um, Cindy to start, oh yeah,

Ann: 25:35

yeah. Before we go into like what you're going to share right now, there were a couple of things that you shared and, um, I just kind of wanted to go back and expand a little bit on them, um, before we get to like. The miracle. Um, so you shared about, you know, I'm going back to when you shared about, uh, your, I believe it was the, the first loss, um, when you had the phone call with your friend. Um, and you know how she was pregnant and at this point you're feeling envious, you're feeling bitter just toward people who are having babies because you know, you, you suffer the loss of, you're suffering the loss of your child at that time. And um, and so you said that, you know, She called you and she started checking up on you. Um, I, I'm just so moved by your friend and her response to your loss and to your pain that she was, able to in that moment, put aside her joy, um, to meet you in your grief and in your hurt and in your suffering and not making you feel bad or not making you feel weird about it, but really just coming to you and sitting with you in, in your grief. Um, can you tell me a little bit more about that?

Cindy: 27:11

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it was, um, I believe it was our second, our second miscarriage. Um, and right after that happened, um, you know, she was pregnant and she just kind of, we would talk like here and there, but it wasn't like, you know, how's the baby, how are you feeling? You know, it wasn't the way that we normally were. Cause she. We and her got pregnant at the same time when we were 20, um, so our sons pretty much grew up together and We we know how we were at that time. You know, we were just like together all the time And how are you feeling? The baby is this length, you know He's this much this time and she knew that I I wasn't writing to her like every day and and just being like how are you? How are you feeling and things like that? And And when she would call me, I would just kind of, you know, just be like, yeah, you know, I'm sad and, you know, like talk about that. And I do appreciate how she was always like, Cindy, you can come to me and tell me, you know, how you're feeling and everything. And even when we had that heart to heart, you know, she's like, if you ever need to call me and you just want to talk about your babies and, you know, What the future that you hoped for them and where would they be right now? And, you know, with our, our last one in 2020, she's like, you know, they, they would have already been one or two, or, you know, what you would have been doing with them and I was just like, wow, you know, you, you care so much that you, I can share with you my hope in, you know, what we would have been doing with our babies and, um, you know, You know, just being able to just talk about that where, you know, some people might be like, you just let it go, you know, like, it's so forget about them, you know, you lost them. That's it. And, you know, um, she was always just like, what can I do to help you and to just love on you? And I do appreciate that so much because I remember one time I shared, um, like things that you hear after you had a miscarriage and things like you don't want to hear. And in one of those, she said, like, wow. I remember I told you one of those things like, Oh, it's a good, at least you can get pregnant or, you know, things like that, that, that we are pretty much things we kind of say to people that, um, go through miscarriage just to kind of give them like light, but it's, you don't realize that it does still hurt. Um, and she was like, wow, you know, like your story has really helped me to just change my system, like how I ask people to like, When are you going to have a baby when you don't even know our people struggling, you know, and, um, I appreciate how much she wanted to learn with me and for me, you know, just to kind of be that friend and be there with me and hurt with me. Um, you know, she. And so many of my other friends too were doing alter calls with me, laying hands on me, praying for me. She would cry so much with me, um, when we would do alter calls and, you know, she would get on her knees for me and yell for me and, you know, it's like, father, just, you're going to bless her with a baby. I know you are father. And so many times that we would just call each other and cry. And I still remember that phone call we did. We, we cried so much, you know, cause she just like reminded me like that. That's not you, Cindy. You're not an envious person. You You know, you have such a big heart and, you know, she's like, I know, I know it's tough and I love what you said. She did not make me feel bad about it. And that is so true. After we had our baby, I just told her, I was like, I feel terrible. Like you had been texting me every day. How are you doing? How's our miracle baby? And I wasn't like that with you. And she's like, it's okay, girl. Like, I know what you are going through. And, um, You know, she's just, she's just amazing. I, I thank God so much for her because she was just someone that I knew I can go to with any ridiculous thought. You know, like, I just want to talk about my babies and what they would be doing right now. Um, so she was, she was really amazing through it all. And, you know, just someone that I know. I can talk to aside from my husband of like, this is what our kids would be doing. And I'm feeling this.

Ann: 31:31

Yeah. And I think that's so important that, you know, um, when we suffer a loss. It takes time to process it, you know, it takes time to process those hard. Emotions and feelings and, um, you know, what, what could have been and, you know, um, all these, all these thoughts that come to our mind. And one thing that I loved, um, hearing about your friend was that she was there in the process. You know, she wasn't there when, when things were better. She was there when, you were struggling and when you were hurting and when you were angry and. When you were envious and you were jealous and, and she didn't, make you feel bad about that. And, I think that having someone That we can go to just knowing like they're present there. We can go to them. I might not feel like going to you now at this moment because I'm still processing, but at least knowing you're offering to be there for me, knowing that you're praying for me, um, giving me the space that I need and then when I'm ready, like, you're there. Yeah. That, that is such a beautiful, um, that's a beautiful way to remind people who are hurting and grieving, um, that, that not only is God with them, but like, you're not alone, I'm with you too. And I'm here for you no matter what. Uh, I just love that about your friend. And I do want to say this, that we can become those friends, I don't want to, discourage someone who may have been that friend, like, oh, I try to fix her and I try to make everything better and I try to slap a scripture on it, you know. Um, I just want to say to that friend that. You can, you can be that present friend, what it is, is that a lot of us are very uncomfortable with grief and loss. And I say that because that was me, that was me. It's taken, actual opportunities where I've had to now be able to sit and with people in their pain and hurt that has actually taught me how to do that because I was the fixer. I was very uncomfortable with people's pain and, um, through my own religious glasses, you know, I wanted to slap that scripture and, and tell them, Hey, you know, um, be encouraged, you know, be strong in faith and, because it was just so uncomfortable to sit with them in their tears and in their, in their hurt and in their anger, so, I want to encourage that friend out there who may be feeling like that and, also just to the woman who's going through it, there are a community of women who have gone through what you're going through and Cindy's one of them. And I am one of them. And you're not alone, and it's okay to process. It's okay to feel what you need to feel. But don't isolate yourself. Um, you know, when someone says, Hey, I'm here, it's okay to give them a call. It's okay to text them. It's okay to cry with them. You don't have to sit with this alone. And, and so I don't know if you want to share a little bit about that.

Cindy: 34:53

That is so good. And that is so true. I feel like everyone was seeing that I was isolating myself. Um, I, I didn't want to be around anyone, you know, it was like me and my husband and I was like, no one understands our pain, you know, and you kind of just get yourself in that funk of like, no one understands what I'm going through and, you know, you kind of just feel like a victim, you know, like, no, it's just happening to me. And, um, I remember his, my mother in law, you know, she would reach out to me and to us and just be like, you know, you guys don't have to stay away from us. And, um, my sister in law was pregnant and I was just like, I am surrounded by every pregnant woman possible. It's insane. Um, and I remember I was just like, you know what? I do need God to work, work in this and me, because I can't do it alone. Like I can't God, I was like, I can't face everyone. And I just want to. Go and hide in a fetal position and, you know, just everyone leave me alone. And you're right. You can't, you can't just like wallow in there in that pity and in that pain, because it's going to eat you up. And just like as much as we can always talk to God, but we need that community. We need to be surrounded by, um, you know, people that love God, love us. And that can always point us to the father. Um, I feel like that's. That's what everyone around us did from his family, my family, my friends, my, my close friend and just everyone. And I feel what you said to where you have to allow people if they want their space, allow them, you know, give them that. And a lot of my friends and family did that, like they knew that I was hurting and they knew maybe right now is not the time for me to, you know, kind of keep pushing myself in her life. And they did step away and. When I, when we had our baby, you know, I, I told him, I was like, you know what? I know. I kind of stopped my friendship with a lot of people just because of everything that we were going through for these two and a half, three years. And, you know, I was like, I just thank you guys for. Not shaming me or, you know, like, I don't want to be your friend anymore. Don't talk to me anymore because you stopped talking to me for so long. They, you know, greeted me with open arms, you know, just like, we love you. We understand. And you know, when you reached out, we were there when you did it. We understood. And I love that, that we had that community with everyone and everyone understood our pain and why we did what we did, um, which is amazing because I feel like you, you need that you need. Understanding from everyone and you don't need people to make you feel bad because you're not present and you know, make you feel like what, what, why, why aren't you being in my life right now, you know, for those big moments and I'm just so thankful because that is God, you know, he was, he was In everyone just showing up his love

Ann: 38:01

that that's so that's so important, you know, having that community of people and family, um, who's praying, who's praying for you and who's there for you, who's present for you, cause grief and loss, especially of a child is one of those things that, we don't know how to handle. It's not for us to handle. It's for us to trust that God's taking care of this person who's hurting and we can pray along with them and we can just be present when they're ready to share when they're ready to You know, or, or like your friend who came looking for you, who said, Hey, I'm, I'm here, you know, just want to remind you I'm here, you know, if you, if you need me friend, right? Um, those, those sweet little reminders that come out of nowhere, like, I'm here for you, and that's so important. I did want to ask you this. I know that, You, you mentioned your husband and how you were both grieving. So yes, it was you, but he was grieving and your son was grieving too. So you have a family here that's grieving the loss of a child. What role did your husband have in your loss and in your grief and how did he get through it?

Cindy: 39:20

Yeah. Oh, great question. I feel like. He was honestly, every time I'm just like, he was just giving me hope. You know, he would just always be like, well, we got to cling to God and we don't know why it's happening, but you know, we just got to trust him. And I always will look at him. Cause I feel like I would always lose hope more than he did. Um, he would always point me to the father and we would have just really raw conversations. And, you know, like we would ask each other. How is our marriage going to look if we can't have a baby, you know, are we still going to be happy? Um, you know, are you, are you still happy with me? Am I still happy with you? And I remember I battled with that a lot, you know, just like asking him, you almost feel like, wow, I am failing at the one thing that a woman needs to do, you know? And I would tell him that, and I would be like, I can't give you a baby, like, do you still love me? And, you know, it was just. Makes me so emotional because it's just so, I remember feeling that so many times. Um, and his answer to me, you know, was always just like, I don't love you because of you being able to give me a baby, you know, like I love you for you. And, um, he was just always, I don't, I honestly, I don't even know like how he did it. Cause he always had a lot of hope. It was just insane. I feel like I was always the one spiraling. We're not going to have a baby. God, what are you doing? Like, I'm so sad. And, um, I know we talked about like this pregnancies and everyone getting pregnant around us. And he would just say like, Wow, it hurt, you know, and, and, uh, he did tell me like the third and fourth miscarriage hit him really hard. Uh, he was like that just, I was not expecting that. And, you know, he, he went through his own things of like, is it me? Like, you, am I the reason why we're not getting pregnant? Like, is something wrong with me? Um, and, um, You know, it was just so many lies that the enemy was trying to feed him, but he just kept like his relationships just got so strong. Like he just started reading the Bible. Um, you know, he, he was like, I'm not going to go to church. Like that's where I grew up. And, you know, he had his own relationship with God. He wanted to start attending church and, you know, just like doing things and just trusting God, like I could see it. It wasn't just like him saying like, I trust God. Like I can just see him like, you know what? We're going to be happy with whatever situation we're in, and we're just going to trust God. And you know, he would, we would pray so much and we would cry together. And I told him like, I just thank you for always pointing me to our father. Like you never once told me like, you know what, you're right. We're not going to have a baby. Like, no, he was like, no, Cindy, God promised us a child and we're going to have a child. And you know, like it, it says it here in the Bible. He promised. You know, just Hannah and Abraham and, you know, he was just like, it's going to happen for us and we're going to have a baby. Um, but I appreciate him just like hearing all my thoughts, all the, all the helpless and, you know, just like bad thoughts that I had. He always heard me. He never made me feel like I wasn't, I feel like that was my biggest struggle. I am failing as a woman, you know, like I can't give you a baby. And he never once made me feel like it's your fault. We're having all these miscarriages because of you. Like, you know, what's, what's happening. It was just like, no, we're, we're going to fight this together. And I don't know what God's planning in our life and what his plan is, but we're going to get through this together and we're going to continue just holding onto that hope, you know, trusting him. Um, and with our son, Oh my goodness. I, I battled with like. oversharing because he was young, you know, it started when he was five, but God really said to us like No, this, this is a testimony. This is going to build his faith and he's seeing it starting at five, you know, just like he would pray so much. God, give us a baby. God, every night, never missed. He always prayed so much. Um, and you know, through, we shared pretty much every loss with him. Um, you know, we're like, Oh, we're pregnant. And then. your siblings in heaven now, you know, and it's okay. It's God's will. And, and, you know, he, he would just be like, it's okay, mom, we got to trust in God. I was like, you're right. You're right. We got to trust in him. And just seeing the miracle now, his faith, you know, we always tell him, like, do you remember how much mommy and daddy had to wait for Jordan to come? And he's like, yeah, it's okay. Almost three years, you know, we were like, what does that, what does that tell you about God? He's faithful. You know, he's with us in our pain. He, you know, he's suffering with us and he, God just really showed me like, this isn't your, you know, your, your testimony to just keep for you guys. You got to share this with him because that's going to, you know, that's going to grow him. And I know he's later on in life, he's just going to remember that. Remember how we trusted in God and how we came to him every night with that same request without stopping.

Ann: 45:02

It sounds like, four losses. The pain that came with each child, each loss, um, the pain that came with, processing it as a family unit with your husband. With your child. It seems like from what you're saying this this kind of forged your faith It forged your faith in the Lord that even when you were like you said hopeless your husband God used your husband To come in and shed hope in Christ, right? He's your child. You know, his, his words, mama, trust in the Lord, and now, you you, you said his name, baby Jordan, baby Jordan, right? The blessing, the blessing after the pain, the blessing after the loss, right? The waiting, the trusting, the praying, the crying, the anger, all of it, right? Every single emotion that you can think of and every single prayer that was lifted up. And, just all this coming together, your husband. His faith being strengthened, his relationship with the Lord being strengthened, your relationship with the Lord being strengthened. We don't realize sometimes how much we are needy of God until we truly, truly need him, you know, and, and, and that's, That's every day, every moment of our lives. We are needing of our father because without him, we can do nothing, you know? So just, hearing how the Lord, forged your faith through this process and through your loss and through your hurts. And hearing now that. You know, baby Jordan, baby Jordans, he, he's, you get words now. Can you tell us about this? What's what's happening now?

Cindy: 47:05

Yes. Yes. And, you know, we were reading Joshua and you know, the Jordan River, how God had them pass through that. And we were like, you know what? You are our Jordan, like you are our river that we had to cross. And God promised us, just like he promised. Joshua, you're, you're going to pass through there and we, when we, when we thought about that, which is funny, cause we've had that name, um, since our second miscarriage. And we were like, no, we're going to cross that Jordan River. And as soon enough as we, we had, and we're like, all right, Jordan, it is, you are our river. Um, but yes, we, so we were, we were battling with IVF, um, right, right before my sister's wedding. And we were like, all right. God, if this is your will, um, which even with IDF, it isn't a guarantee. You can always miscarry as well. Um, you, you, you don't know, you know, it's all, it's all up to God. What happens, you know, if that baby keeps growing or if not. And so we were like, okay, we're going to try it. Um, we signed all the documents, we did everything. Um, the medication was to arrive when we came back from Florida, uh, that was like January of the second week, maybe. We got back and the medication was already here. So, you know, I was like, okay, it has to start when my cycle starts. So I was like, all right, it should be here in a couple of days. And well, you know, a couple of days came and I was like, you know what, I think I'm late. And so, um, took a pregnancy test and oh my goodness. I cannot tell you how I, I dropped to my knees. I was crying. I was just like lifting my hands. I was like, God. This is a miracle. Like we were just gonna start IVF. The medication is here and I'm pregnant. Like that is insane. Um, I called her doctor and, you know, she's like, what? Like, that's, that's amazing. You're pregnant. Like, you know, come on in. Like, we got to do your blood tests and, you know, let's just see how your levels are and stuff. And we did the blood work and she's like, you're pregnant. And, you know, they had us, they were very closely just kind of monitoring. Monitoring me. Um, you know, I would go in pretty much every week, making sure my levels were rising. And, um, we did maybe weekly ultrasound, uh, starting at, uh, The five weeks when I found out, um, and you know, we, we did have to do, uh, like medications and, and shots, um, just to kind of help. They, they don't know the cause of why it was happening, um, but they kind of put me on like blood thinners, uh, like an injection, a low of an oxygen injection. And, you know, they were just like. If this works, because we, we got past the eight weeks, pretty much around eight weeks was when the heartbeat would kind of stop beating. Um, so we got past the eight weeks and they're like, you know what, we're going to stick with this. You're, you'll stay on your shots until, uh, 37 weeks. Um, so, uh, I was like, Hey, if that's what God wants me to do, I'll do it. You have your way Lord. And, um, Yeah, they, I am very, very thankful for, uh, what God was doing. You know, he, He had me pregnant just naturally, you know, it just happened. I didn't need IVF, um, even the medication. I remember again, here comes that enemy. Like, wow, look at you. You have to have medication when, when everyone else does the need to do medication. And I was like, you know what devil? No, if this is what God has me doing, then I'm going to trust him. And I'm going to be thankful because I have a baby that's growing, thriving. Like you're not going to bring me down. You're not going to steal my joy. And, you know, I got out of that. pity mentality of like, why do I have to give myself shots? Like, no, I am happy. If this is what God wants me to do, then that's his, his will for me. And I prayed a lot too, as well, with like the Loba nuts, like God, if we're meant to still keep this going on for the entire pregnancy, So let that be done. If it isn't, then you stop it. And, you know, it was a lot of battling as well because you're kind of scared. You're scared every moment. Every day I was just terrified. Like, is the baby, is he growing? And every week I would just hold my breath and every appointment that we went to, we would just, I would just end up leaving crying because I'm just like, he's, he's, the baby's still there. It's growing. Um, you know, everything's okay. And every ultrasound, I would just like cry. And you know, the technician already knew me like, okay, here's and I would just tell her, this is we had four miscarriages. So this is our, you know, our fifth one, like, bear with me. I'm an emotional rep every week. Just holding my breath. But I, I still remember, like, even now we still see him and we're just like, can you believe he's here? Like God did that. God gave us our miracle baby. Like we just, I go through so many moments of just staring at him and crying, like, you know, thank you God, thank you God. And I just feel like I, I always love sharing the testimony of what he is like. I always say he's our miracle baby, you know? And I love. Just everyone telling me like, wow, my son is going through that. My daughter in law is going through that, or many people, I went through that and you know, I'm just like all the glory that God is getting through him of me just saying he's our miracle baby. You know, every time you see a baby, you're just like, oh baby, and I'm always like, yep, he's our miracle baby. Like, let me, let me tell you, oh my God, he is just amazing. And here he is, you know, just to see the, see him. And everyone just kind of. Get that hope of like, wow, you went through four losses. It can happen to me too, you know? And it's, it's amazing what God is doing and what he did with him. And, and I know he just has a great testimony for him. Um, we always say that we're like, we don't know why the other four are not here. But Jordan, you have. Such a big mission to fulfill with God and you're just, I just know it, I can feel it.

Ann: 53:30

Yeah, wow, that's so precious. And his name, I'm just getting. Right now as, as you were sharing the story of Joshua, his name and how you said we had to cross the Jordan, that, that was a huge task for them to do, right, to cross the Jordan, to get to the other side, and in it, um, They learned a lot. They learned a lot in the, in, in, on their way and crossing the Jordan. And what a beautiful reminder, right? Your son's name itself is such a beautiful reminder that with God, we can, we can cross it. We can cross to the other side and he's with us and we're not alone as we go through the hurdles and the tests and the challenges that come with crossing over. He's very present with us. And so I'm just so, touched by your story. Um, I know, and I pray that many women who are going through this now, who are, grieving now, who, who may even be rejoicing with you. Maybe they have their Jordans, you know, they've crossed their Jordan and they're in a place where, they have their miracle baby and maybe other moms who are still waiting on their miracle baby. What words of hope and encouragement would you like to leave them with Cindy?

Cindy: 54:59

Oh, yes. I would honestly say, um, I feel like we are kind of what I went through where I separated myself. I think we do need moments for ourselves to kind of, you know, kind of get in our own head of like, what am I going through? So don't do that alone. You have to do that with God. You know, that is one thing I learned in the beginning with the first one. I, I wasn't really reading. I, it was just like kind of starting my relationship with God. So, um, I, that's kind of what pushed me, you know, I, I need to start reading my Bible. I need to start reading devotionals and as every miscarriage happened, I only just felt that fire for God. And, you know, it was just like, you know what, Lord, as long as I have you, that's fine. Um, and it is just, you know, You have to read, read the Bible, talk to him, share everything, you know, the good, bad, and the ugly. He wants to hear it all. You know, he already knows it. He knows how we're feeling. But when you vocalize it, it just like, it feels like a weight lifted off your shoulders. You know, I felt like I was struggling so much with the whole envy, like, that's not me. I'm not feeling that. But deep down, he knows what I'm feeling. But when I actually said it, and, you know, what? Talk to him when I'm angry, when I'm sad, when I'm feeling every emotion and just talking to him, he is a very present God and he is there for us. And just knowing that he also speaks to us, um, that's something that he will do when you actually take the time to talk to him and, you know, share with him. Um, I, I'm telling you, I still think of that time when he told me, Your sister's pregnant, but your time is coming, like only God can do that. And how he just filled me with that hope and that, that, you know, it was like a warm embrace. Like, thank you God for telling me and caring about me so much. And that is, that is our father. He cares about us. He loves us so much. And, um, we just have to make sure that we spend time with him and that we read his word. And, um, I think also as well, the people that you surround yourself with, uh, you know, make sure that it's people that. that know God that love you and that can be. That encouragement, but also allow you to kind of be in your own feelings and, you know, just, just be there for you whenever you are ready to go to them or if you need to step away, you know, they'll always greet you with open arms.

Ann: 57:31

Yeah. Oh, that's. That is so beautiful. It's true. It's true. We need that type of support that, that nonjudgmental listening. Um, it goes a long way when you're going through grief and loss, you know, and, um, the prayers of, of people who your faith may be tested in that moment, but they have the faith to say, Hey, you know, We're here for you. We're going to believe with you and we're going to stand here with you. That speaks volumes. Um, when you're going through through loss, I also wanted to mention, and I believe I heard you say that there was a point. Where you had to take your focus off of the whole, this whole idea of having the child and this whole idea of you being pregnant and having this child where your focus went shifted, it took a pivot. It went from focusing so much on the child. To now focusing on God and trusting him with that desire. Can you share a little bit about that? And the reason why I feel like it's so important, because I know that, when you've gone through loss after loss, and I've experienced that myself, and so I'm speaking from my own experience, that I felt like. It almost became an idol, that whole idea of having this child, the whole idea almost became an idol because I was consumed, as consumed with this idea, I was consumed with what it was supposed to look like, you know, so can you speak a little bit into that?

Cindy: 59:14

Oh, yes, that is so true. It was, that was my idol. I was like, Thinking about it so much. It literally consumed me and my relationship with my husband. You know, it was just like, I want a baby and I want a baby and I want a baby now tracking everything, you know, like when are we ovulating when, you know, it's just like, and he was like, this is not how it's how it's supposed to be Cindy. Like, you know, we need to enjoy our marriage and how, how You know, how a baby, uh, comes into your life and it isn't like attract everything. You know, it, it consumed me so much where I was buying every ovulation pregnancy kit, like everything, you know, I was just like, all right, I got to download this app and do that. So it very much was an idol in my life. And I don't, I don't know how, but that sermon that, that said that about God, if it's your will, then keep that desire. And I remember I also heard another one where it was like, Everyone always says, you deserve this, you deserve that, and he's like, we are not deserving of anything, um, but God gives it to us by his grace and mercy, and I was like, thank you, I needed that, like, here I am thinking, like, well, God, I'm a Christian, my husband's a Christian, I'm a better Christian than that person, and you gave them a baby, I'm a better person than that. That other person that's a nonbeliever and you're giving them a baby like I deserve a baby and you know, it was just like that feeling of deserve when I heard that I was just like, I am idolizing this idea of being pregnant and getting a baby and what it's going to do for our family when I'm supposed to just focus on you guys and not what you do for me and for us, but because of who you are, you know, and yeah. Oh, that was just a big change. And I am thankful for that because I now shift my thought about that too, of like. No, I'm not deserving, but God, you gave me all these blessings because you are so merciful, you are so, you give me so much grace. I fail, I fail you so many times, but yet you still give me all these blessings. And I thank you for that. Even him dying on the cross for us. Like I didn't deserve that, but you still did it for me because you love me so much. Um, you know, and it was just. It changed. It changed everything. Um, and I'm so thankful for that, for that sermon that I heard because the Holy Spirit just, you know, that conviction of like, that's me. I'm doing that. I'm that person saying I deserve. Um, and I'm just, I'm really glad for that because he just, it just, he spoke to me so quickly. I was like, yup, that is so me. I, I can't be idolizing this baby. I need to, you know, I just need to worship and love you, God, and that's it.

Ann: 1:02:12

That's that right there, right? I just, uh, just worship and love and adore him. I know there's a lot of women who are not able to have children. And they, they may suffer loss after loss. Some of them don't even, you know, don't even get that far. I, I want to say, you know, before we end this episode to the women that who are not able to have children, you know, I have children and I don't know, I don't know what you're feeling and what you're going through or how this podcast may even, um, touch your own heart and affect you. I do want to say this, that you are a daughter of God and you are precious. And you being able to bear children or not doesn't make you, it's not, it's not who you are. Right? You are, your identity, who you are, this valuable woman. This valuable life, the soul that you are, um, you are precious and valuable and your worth is in God. Because of who God has made you and called you to be. And your identity is found in him. So I just wanted to share that as we close off. Um, and Cindy, if you have any words before we close out. Well,

Cindy: 1:03:52

that is so true. I think that is. One thing that we have to learn through, even it doesn't even matter if it's miscarriage or any, anything that you're going through, our identity isn't what we're trying to achieve found in God and who he made us, you know, daughter, son, it's the, when we cling to that and to God, you know, whatever else that we're trying to achieve it and it isn't happening, we'll find happiness and joy in that, in just God, that's it. Uh, you know, we can't claim our happiness and joy on. Circumstances and, you know, things of this world, it even says it there, you know, like do not cling on to what this world is, you know, our gift is, is God and what he. It's who he is to us.

Ann: 1:04:39

Yes. Yes. Cindy, I just want to thank you so much for being my guest today. It's been such a blessing hearing your story and getting to know you. And I thank God for this miracle that he's done in your life with baby Jordan. And, you know, just your, your testimony, your family testimony of how, you know, the Lord has brought your husband, you. Your son and now baby Jordan, um, through this and, um, he's continuing to move in your life through your life. I'm sure you have, you mentioned it at the beginning. You have quite a few testimonies of God's grace and goodness. Amen. Yes. And as children of God, right, we share that in common. He's, he's just such a good God, such an amazing father. And so I just, again, thank you for, for being my guest today.

Cindy: 1:05:35

Oh, thank you so much for having me. It's such a joy just spreading, you know, what God has done in my life. I know this is going to touch a lot of people. Um, like I said, it may not just be miscarriage, but you're going through something, but just knowing and seeing that hope that God is with us and, you know, he's for us, he's not against us. So. We just got to cling to him and go to him, um, to be with him. That's all he wants from us. You know, just the relationship.

Ann: 1:06:05

Thank you so much, Cindy. Uh, to the listeners who have watched this episode with us and who are listening on the podcast, uh, please continue to share her scars, tell a story podcast via Spotify. Um, this will probably post on YouTube. So look out for, um, Cindy story on YouTube and please share, share with the women in your life. If, if you know someone who, um, this may minister to please share. Sometimes we question, should I, it may be too soon. Just share and let, let the person decide if it's too soon or not. Right. Um, so thank you for listening to her scars. Tell a story podcast. See you on the next episode.